Talk: Great War

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Tim Cain

Aptyp once asked Tim Cain about this, and Timmy said planes. So there you are. Spazmo 21:16, 8 May 2005 (CEST)

But what about "spears of nuclear fire rained from the sky" from the FO2 intro? I'd say that it was mostly planes, but some rockets were also used... Ausir 23:24, 8 May 2005 (CEST)

FO2 is not canon. Also, Tim said something along the lines of "uhh I dunno, I'd say planes". --161.88.255.139 17:27, 29 Jul 2005 (CEST)

• Realize this is an old post I'm replying to but uhh.. source for FO2 being non-canon?

Fallout BOS is non Canon , Fallout is canon either someones trolling or just not paying attention *facepalm* 82.28.198.135 18:16, November 21, 2012 (UTC)

It was Missiles

People seriously! You are getting into arguments about nukes. Black isle and bethesda aren't telling us and likely they used both for maxiumum damage. and the thing is is that they're dead we're alive and have to live through their f****** communism hating mistake

It is my esteemed opinion that "total nuclear annihilation" can not be achieved in a mere "two hours" with just planes. I don't see both China and the United States being capable of launching potentially hundreds of aircraft at once, potentially within minutes of each other (If the planes weren't launched within minutes of each other, how would China and the US wipe each other out?), flying over every city of each nation and successfully dropping nuclear weapons without being intercepted or shot down. It just seems a bit silly (after all, wouldn't they meet somewhere over the ocean and have a dog fight?). The other point is, we're talking about the WHOLE WORLD here, not just China and the US. "In two brief hours most of the planet was reduced to cinders.".

While it might be nice to think it can happen that way, it is my belief that Fallout was structured around a modern-era "ICBM Battle". Fallout is a mix of both 50's era cold war style setting with modern technology and modern thoughts. In some cases it's what people in the 50's thought the future would be like but in others it borrows thoughts from the modern era, such as a war with China - as opposed to the classic 50's thinking of Russia. The German development of the V2 series of rockets combined with the nuclear weapon would've been a devastating arsenal.

There's also this: http://www.duckandcover.cx/gallery/albums/Fallout_Bonus_Art/History2_Gray.gif

I *believe* that was going to be the original cover for the Fallout box (see the screen shots which are the same as some which were used on the box). I believe it's now only found in the Fallout root directory if you undat master.dat. As you'll note, it contains a number of facts which have been deemed canon. I see no reason to discount the sentence "In the early morning of Saturday, October 23, 2077 the sky was filled with nuclear missiles".

As has been said, there is much more evidence present both in game and out that indicates it was missiles rather than aircraft - or at least that missiles where what the developers had in mind for the most part.

~DarkUnderlord

Well, both theories have advocates:

• Missile: a MIRV was probably aimed at Springvale but this particular warhead didn't go off for some reason.
• Bomb: a bomber was on route to D.C. when it crashed, the bomb being the payload.

Since there are evidence that the Fallout timeline had intercontinental missiles, it is impossible the brass wouldn't see the advantages of that as a warhead delivery method.--Amitakartok 20:39, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

If I may add to this rather old discussion. Keep in mind that there was hardly any oil left, and most planes would have no fuel to fly on, or at least no fuel of reliable quality. The military may have just decided that intercontinental nuclear missiles, which had not been touched since they were created (and because of this reason still had good quality fuel) would be more reliable. It would also explain why they would have been hard to intercept as there'd be no decent planes up in the air. --Ijiero 18:21, January 24, 2010 (UTC)

maybe subs luanched it

Real world doctrine by both the USA and USSR was to scramble literally every method of nuclear delivery we know of and possibly even a few we don't. We can safely assume that in Fallout the situation was very much the same, with ICBMs first to be deployed and Strategic Bombers having been scrambled within 5 minutes of that. Given Fallout's stealth technology and presumably impressive cruising speeds, which may be transsonic if not outright supersonic, interception would be difficult and payloads delivered within a few hours. Now 2 hours is a bit fast but from this we are best assuming that either A: That is the time which it took for a critical number of nukes to be delivered and some bombers and missiles were still in transit regardless. Or B: Bombers in the fallout universe are that fast and took less than 2 hours to fly transpacific. Both are equally well supported unless we find evidence that cruising speeds of strategic bombers was too low in which case B is impossible and A is correct. Technically C and D exist where only missiles and only bombers were used respectively, but I refuse to acknowledge the possibility and will simply ignore Bethesda if they confirm it on the grounds of it being retarded.--Betrix5068 (talk) 15:24, September 17, 2018 (UTC)

Reasons why it can't be planes

When nuclear bombs are droped there is a EMP released which disables all electric equipment. there was a black out in Hawaii which was more than likely because the it would travel across the pacific oceans It is easier to fire lots of missiles than it is to lunch lots of planes at exactly the same time. --Goodyme 18:05, 12 March 2009 (UTC)[goodyme]

Look up history kid. Especially the Nagasaki and Hiroshima bombings as well as B-52 and Cold War. That Furry Bastard 00:40, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

And look up nukes' technical details and/or nuclear physics too. A nuke's EMP gets stronger with altitude. So, blow a nuke 1-2 km above D.C. and hello, Capital Wasteland. Blow the nuke approx. 400-500 km high over Kansas and bye-bye North America's technology (even though it's way too high to cause physical damage). In a nutshell, EMP has three components: E1 is the most dangerous and is caused by gamma radiation creating a vetrical electron stream aimed towards the surface and moving at RELATIVISTIC speeds (meaning they have so much kinetic energy that atmosphere won't stop them); E2 is the weakest due to it's similarity to lightning; E3 is caused by the nuke interacting with the Earth's residual magnetic field similarly to a solar flare, causing geomagnetically induced current that can damage long conductors, ie. power lines. Plus, vacuum tubes used everywhere in the Fallout timeline are nearly immune to EMP. Why do you think real-life Soviet avionics were built from these?--Amitakartok 20:31, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

There seem to be something contradictory: When you take a look at the nuke in Megaton, you'll notice it's a copy of the bombs dropped in Japan: A typical nuclear bomb, incapable of long-distance flights. However, when taking a look at the various nukes found in the craters around Washington DC, you'll notice it's actually a missile, and not a bomb. So this is something very odd.

There doesn't need to be a contradiction here. We can simply assume that both bombs that were dropped by planes, as well as missiles were used in the Great War. Ausir 20:18, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

Or the missiles were launched from bombers to reduce chances of interception (bomber comes in, you send fighters; the bomber launches a missile at the last moment, but it is too close to be intercepted by anti-missile systems).--Amitakartok 20:42, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

For the comment above it really depends on what kind of missiles we're talking about. I'm going to assume that they're cruse missiles that are small yet slow (I'm not 100% sure but I think that the Tomahawk (the main US cruse missile) moves at 400 mph). A fighter can easily find one (stealth technology didn't come out yet) and, with the proper weapons shoot one down. Dangerous? Yes. Impossible? No. During WWII, the Gloster Meteor was used to attack and shoot down V1 Buzz Bombs, the predicessor to all cruse missiles. Based on what I know about the Cold War (which was still going on in Fallout's timeline right?) We (the US) had bombers constantly flying around the planet loaded with a nuclear payload. These were the first strike if anyone got frisky with the nukes and then the ICBMs would finish off the target. How well that would've worked, I don't know as (thankfully) WWIII never happened.--KnightNapier 16:40, December 19, 2009 (UTC)

and dont forget that in game play you can use sattilights in space from pre war tech to destroy the mobel base crawler and its used other times they may have not even used planes but propped the bombs form them and they just fell like the one in megaton but that one just failed to trigger the prosses of explotion and i think thats my theory anyone with

According to DEFCON doctrine bombers must be ready to ready to deploy within 5 minutes of scrambling at DEFCON 2, 30 minutes at DEFCON 3, and already in the air at DEFCON 1. Unless the USA is at DEFCON 3 for god knows what reason and only detects a launch with 10 minutes to spare, both utter absurdities, there is plenty of time to scramble the airforce and deploy them. Now Missiles alone could and most likely did annihilate both nations, but that is only relevant if those bombers RTB and actually plan on going back for another run. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Betrix5068 (talk • contribs) 15:41, September 17, 2018 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~!

Series of Wars

It says the resource wars were followed by the great war, but it was followed by the Cola Wars. Somebody should look into that. :)

Fallout 3's oddity.

I think DarkUnderlord up there is clearly right, it makes the most sense, and with the release of Fallout 3 is backed-up (with what appears to be) by the presence of ICBM silos in some of the millitary bases. BUT, there is one issue with all of this, and thats the nuke at megaton, which is clearly a bomb and not a missle. Its hard to imagine a Chinese bomber flying all the way to the US WHILST the country is being lit-up with missles, so maybe its actually an American device?

Which country? US or China? Unless they are taking off as nukes are making touchdown it really doesn't matter. US doctrine was to have bombers in the air on DEFCON 1 and expected them to be ready to fly within minutes during DEFCON 2. We can assume China, not being stupid, has a similar doctrine. As such by the time missiles contact the bombers would be somewhere over the pacific.--Betrix5068 (talk) 15:41, September 17, 2018 (UTC)

Well, it IS identical to the ones in Fort Constantine.

Nuclear bombs probably wouldn't look all that different after 200 years of rusting. Especially since the Russians made their bombs based off of ours(so they would look similar), and they basically gave that technology to the Chinese. Thus, they wouldn't look much different from one another. ````MainMeister

Correction: Russia stole the nuke design from the US, but refused to give it to their "Chinese comrades". Mao got pissed and left the Soviets high and dry, then built one on their own. At least this is what happened in our universe.--Amitakartok 17:56, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Actually, I think Wikipedia says that the thing with Mao started around 1966, so that puts it after divergence. It could of played out differently. --TheFrogger 21:04, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

I know this is an old post but as I was plaing F3 I talked to Manya and she says that the crater was caused by the plane. I figured that as DC got more warning it could have been an American plane that crashed on the way to China. Just my thoughts. GamerAddict7796 17:43, March 25, 2011 (UTC)

I think I read somewere that the big mt facility made a minute man 3 with held 50 nuclear missle that could be dropped at several location the missle was like and icbm expect that all it does is delivers payloads

It was missles AND planes!

I actually think that both planes and missles were used in The Great War.

Due to evidence(Namely, the bomb in Megaton)it appears that the first stikes of the war were made with planes droping nuclear bombs. However, its very likely that counterstrikes(And later, possibly counter-counterstrikes) were done with missles, since, during the midst of a nuclear war, if you didnt have planes already in position to drop nuclear bombs, you wouldnt be able to reach a target via planes quick enough. Thus, missles were used.

--Clon3Troop3r 22:31, 20 March 2009 (UTC)Clon3Troop3r

Evidence: Bomb: Bomb in Megaton (as previously stated), and mini-nukes are bombs, not missiles/rockets. Missile: Silo at Fort Bannister (Most likely housed a nuke), as well as a mostly intact missile in a crater near Our Lady of Hope Hospital (Someone confirm this please, if wrong, I am thinking it is near Vault-Tec HQ).

We must also take into account that the Fallout World is what people believed in the 50s. My point, in Fahrenheit 451, planes moved very, VERY fast. In the 50s, it was believed that the jet plane could reach enormous speeds. Perhaps in the Fallout timestream, this did occur. Then it would be easy to suggest that bombs were used. ````MainMeister

If the planes were fast enough to travel across continents in a few minutes, then yes, bombs were perhaps used, however missles still had to be used. Not every plane armed with a nuke would have made it to its designated target(Some would be shot down by anti-air or enemy fighters) Another interesting theory is that not all of the planes armed with nukes were bombers. There might have been fighters armed with smaller nuclear missles. But still, not every fighter would have made it to its target, resulting in the use of inter-continental missles and such.

--Clon3Troop3r 23:26, 20 March 2009 (UTC)Clon3Troop3r

I would not be surprised at all if fighters were equipped with mininukes. Also, of course planes were shot down, that's how the nuke at Megaton got there. ````MainMeister

Who says that was a chinese bomb? its exactly like the ones stored at Fort Banishter, perhaps it was an American plane that was damaged during the bombing[say by EMP] or was returning from over the ocean and was out of fuel so it dumped its payload before crashing which is why it never detonated.

98.240.210.20 19:53, April 18, 2010 (UTC)

You're all not familiar with your history are you?

During the Cold War, America had bombers constantly flying around the Soviet Union. Each had their own directives for bombing parts of the USSR should America be attacked. Is it hard to believe we were doing the same thing in China, especially as we had just annexed Canada and they had invaded Alaska? I find it entirely believable that they were.

Haven't any of you seen Dr. Strangelove? Dirk Gently 15:52, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Well, it might have been originally intended for Fallout 1 that the bombers were the only way the bombs were dropped, but both [[Fallout 2] and Fallout 3 include references to ICBMs, so it's now canon. Probably both were used. Ausir 15:56, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

No Answer

Good topic but you have to remember that there is no correct answer because Bethesda mixed a little of the bomb and missle theory. It be more likely and realistic if it was the missle theory but since gaming industries can make things fuzzie you never know. Anyways we shouldnt worry too much about this issue.

There is a correct answer, there is a nuclear bomb in the LA Vault in Fallout 1 and there is the Shi in Fallout 2 that are the descendants of the crew of the Chinese Shi-huang-ti ballistic missile submarine.

Unstable AIs?

When asked, the AI of the computer in the BOS base in San Fransisco in FO2 (ACE) says that the mental issues AI's tended to develop (the SF-BOS AI itself feels lonely) might have been one of the reasons for the annihilation in the great war. Should this be included in the article?

ACE Quote:

{208}{}{A true artificial intelligence is possible. A few such systems were completed for military purposes. The project was discontinued.}

{209}{}{Why?}

{210}{}{The suicide rate among true artificial intelligence machines was extremely high. When given full sensory capability the machines became depressed over their inability to go out into the world and experience it. When deprived of full sensory input the machines began to develop severe mental disorders similar to those among humans who are forced to endure sensory deprivation. The few machines that survived these difficulties became incredibly bored and began to create situations in the outside world for their amusement. It is theorized by some that this was the cause of the war that nearly destroyed mankind.}

- limaxophobiac (new here)

Interesting theory, but ultimately unfeasible. It's been said that China kicked everything off, and these AIs were in the States. They'd be unable to launch the Chinese red rain. 5chiz0

Grammar not formal?

Suggesting general grammar clean-up on this page, writing is often prose and should be more formal.

Happy to do it. --Verygoodyear 18:23, 11 March 2009 (UTC) Sam Jordan

Why? This is not Wikipedia, this is a fan-run encyclopaedia. That Furry Bastard 21:19, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

I agree with That Furry Bastard this is a fan run encyclopedia and everyone can understand what is being said and this is a talk page not an article.

As long as the article is readable, it is ok. - Redmess 23:00, October 29, 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia and its subsequent child-projects (Wikia's) are Encyclopaedias and as such should be spelt correctly and all grammar accurate. ThePog 01:28, February 14, 2010 (UTC)

Anybody else?

Did the other countries get hit or not? HuangLee 18:47, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes, nukes were shot everywhere. Killa11 00:25, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

This is a bit confusing. The US were fighting China while Europe were fighting the Middle East. It would've resulted in two nuclear exchanges between these contestants. How did it turned all of a sudden into a classic free-for-all scenario? I mean, why would everyone attack everyone else? They thought "f*** it, if we won't survive, no one else will" and threw M.A.D. right out of the window?--Amitakartok 20:08, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

I'm sure with all of the nukes flying around, governments automatically assumed that their enemies were responsible, or would take advantage of the holocaust to launch their own nukes. Therefore, the only sensible thing to do would be to launch your own arsenal and hope you hurt them more than they hurt you; and even if your enemies had done nothing, then what would you lose by destroying them anyway, they are your enemies right? Also, even if the U.S., China, Europe, and the Middle East were the only ones to fire nukes, a nuclear winter would still be a certainty with all of the fallout scattered into the atmosphere. It wouldn't be hard to assume that any country that wasn't nuked would eventually devolve into lawlessness and barbarism, either through civil panic or wars with other survivors over the scraps the superpower nations left behind. You don't need to irradiate every square inch of the world to destroy civilization, it's all dominoes. 74.215.114.200 20:23, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

In usual wars, nuclear war begins when someone wants someone to surrender or if everything was hopeless. I'm sure everyone was buying the nukes from people like Russia, they used the nukes as warnings and if the opponent didn't surrender well everyone probably started nuking each other. Stuff like this is possible, it's just not really looked in, in the Fallout universe. We may never know how everyone went crazy like this.... Insane Survivor 20:11, 8 June 2009 (UTC)

I think someone was just pissed Im Watching You,bitch.^{([[User talk:Werewolfhell|Leave A Message!]])} 19:19, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

well

i believe that it is set in the future so planes could move very fast and Icbms and nukes could be improved

2 Hours DOES NOT = Total Destruction

Frankly, it would most likely be impossibles for the amount of destruction to have happened in 2 hours without intercontinental missiles the planes would be ant-aircrafted right down. The p 30 minute cross-country flight would take an plane traveling 4000 MPH. That would be probably be the speed Chinese bombers would need to bomb from West to East coast. NOT HAPPENING! However it is a game and is based on a 1950's world view so discrepancies can easily happen. Also, without the development of the silicon chip a nuclear warhead on a missile would be much harder to make.

Yes, it is a game. That's called artistic license. —Preceding comment was unsigned. Please sign your posts with ~~~~!

The US, at least, had orbital strike platforms. It's not unreasonable to assume that the Chinese had them as well, and that they were the source of the majority of the devastation wrought by the war. Kris mailbox 13:55, August 19, 2010 (UTC)

Although the planes look like P-80s and post war aircraft, is it not possibly that the FO world developed advanced aircraft engines. I also think that the "the great war lasted for 2 hours" is probably when the bombs started falling, not the flight over, a thing that supports this is that it is from a civilian perspective.

You're forgetting this is 2077, in 2011 we're already designing bombers able to travel at 13000 miles per hour so even in the fallout universe 4000 is feasable, i belive that the planes were sent to destroy major targets and cripple the us - these being stealth bomber the chinese did not expect the us to react in time, they launches icbms though so china was forced to as well, creating the mix of bombs and misssiles we keep argueing over.

You're all forgetting that by 2077 the US already had Vertibirds.

It would have been impossible for a Chinese bomber to fly across the whole of the US without being intercepted Nick3258 (talk) 13:51, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

It was War and Dick Richardson

War Pronunciation: \ˈwȯr\ Function: noun

1 a (1): a state of usually open and declared armed hostile conflict between states or nations (2): a period of such armed conflict (3): state of war b: the art or science of warfare c (1)obsolete : weapons and equipment for war (2)archaic : soldiers armed and equipped for war2 a: a state of hostility, conflict, or antagonism b: a struggle or competition between opposing forces or for a particular end <a class war> <a war against disease> c: variance, odds 3

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/war

If I'm not mistaken, the launching of devastating nuclear weapons at other countries would probably be considered a state of open and declared armed hostile conflict or a state of hostility, conflict or antagonism.

Also, Dick Richardson could be covering up his own ass, so I don't think we should say "implied" or any other definitive adjective. It should just be noted that Dick Richardson "claimed" that the Chinese fired first-nice and neutral.

The Great War

IT WAS SKYNET.... lol i guess that robo-brain is dead :(

You can see a american intercontinental missile in DC (anywhere in the Washington district and in the museum near the capitol place)

Also, in Megaton the "fatman" a device fired by planes but its very odd because the same devices are in a armory building in the wasteland so every nuke is from the USA :O they bombed themselves to start a big experiment (Vault,FEV...)

I CHANGE MY MIND IT WAS VAULT TEC!!!!! they started the war!!!!

I hope well get some more info in the next Fallout games ;D and maybe in Motership Zeta i hope :D

-David- (Made legible by LoneWarden)

• Before you invest in buying Mothership Zeta, try investing in a dictionary. ThePog 01:24, February 14, 2010 (UTC)

Vault Tec starting the Great War? How the hell could a vault company get its hands on enough nuclear warheads (or any nukes at all) to ass rape pretty much all of the world? it maek nu cents :C --WisestWiseGuy101 22:48, May 3, 2011 (UTC)WisestWiseGuy101

Mothership Zeta

Could it have been the aliens who started the Great War? Alien captive recorded log 17 shows the aliens stealing ICBM launch codes from an American military officer. 200610101010 15:00, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

I think that was cut. The actual recording, if listened to, is an Alien chattering away, no human voice. It might be a bug, but still. Nitty 15:02, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

That would be the STUPIDEST plot twist ever. The entire point of the Fallout series is the survival of humanity after their own stupidity wiped them out.--Doop. 03:59, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

I'll have to agree with that, as well. The whole "the aliens did it!" theory just trivializes the whole point of the series.--Chill02 07:19, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Why kill us all with nukes when they are making such preety pets from us? - RASIC 07:43, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

They actually had viable motives, believe it or not. Humanity was expanding into space at the time, and the aliens themselves were growing bolder on who they were taking. It's easy to ignore them/cover them up when the aliens are simply capturing cattle or low grade nobodys on their way home from church. But now they were capturing astronauts (along with their spaceships), US Senators, etc.

Eventually the US at least would have said to themselves "Hey! There's a bunch of aliens up there that don't exactly have our best interests in mind. We should take them out." If not "Hey! There's a bunch of aliens up there. They might have some nice tech to kill commies with if we get our hands on it. We should board the ship and kill the aliens since they don't have our best interests in mind anyway." and given the tech level of pre-war America, it wouldn't have been long before that happened. The aliens knew that darn well. So what's the best way to stop that?

... Start a nuclear war, of course! That way, man goes back to the stone ages (early industrial age AT BEST), All the tech they could have used against you is lost, and you can go back to scooping up people to turn into aboms without fear of danger or harassment. (At least until you get lazy and complacent from this newfound safety and an ubermensch vault dweller you picked up kicks your little green rear ends to the stars and back.)

Seriously, motivation wise they are the ONLY faction that stood to really gain anything from the Great War (other than the Enclave perhaps). --IAMELIPHAS (talk) 05:06, November 8, 2013 (UTC)

You also have to think, why would they nuke us if they've got the death ray that the lone wander disables?--72.45.7.201 13:27, November 5, 2011 (UTC)Tkoserby

Who says they didn't use that? Could have been they shot the thing just to goad the two nations (who already had their fingers on the fire buttons) into flinging nukes at each other. Like throwing a match into a gasoline puddle. One city goes boom and pretty soon the whole world goes up in flames. --IAMELIPHAS (talk) 05:06, November 8, 2013 (UTC)

I agree I always thought they were the ones to start it because why not, they obviously are unsympathetic to human life, they can continue their experiments after the nukes, and it to me at least fits in line with the whole "grand experiment" concept of fallout in that what if the sole point of the war was simply an experiment started by the aliens to "test" humanity.

Aliens and the great war

Your right although none of us know who started the war it so as hell not the aliens.

Maybe they didn't know what nukes were, or just wanted to play some sick game and see what would happen if they pressed the big red button to have a little laugh (If I was an alien I would do that)

E.T. Doesn't Like Nukes

The idea of Aliens starting the Great War may not be as implausable as it sounds. During the Cold War there have been several reports of UFOs flying around our missile bases. In one case, a UFO was seen flying around a rocket before it exploded and another was a time when an ATLAS missile suddenly armed itself why a UFO was spotted nearby. When the UFO left, the everything went back to normal. I remember this from UFO Files on the History Channel.

Since Fallout is based on the 1950s, it is possible that Aliens may have had something to do with this. While it is a pretty far leap of the imagination does anybody remmeber the original The Day The Earth Stood Still? In it Klatu comes down to convince humans that their work on nuclear weapons should be stopped so we don't blow up everything. Also UFO activity really became hot right after the first atomic explosions. coincidence or something more?

While the Great War was most likely started by us, what if it wasn't and the Aliens caused something to gain from it? My only guess is that they wouldn't feel threatened by our liberal use of nuclear weapons. Klatu also stated that it wouldn't be long before humans made the jump to nuclear powered rockets and then they get really nervous so maybe the Aliens decided to ensure that we would get there.

This is all very specualitve and I don't think Bethesda thought this way, but if you're keeping up with the times of the 1950s this is possible.KnightNapier 15:18, September 1, 2009 (UTC)

It's not that it is farfetched, it's that the entire theme of the series is humanity picking up the pieces of their own devestation. If the aliens did it or had a hand in it, it would kind of be as though the entire point of the series was being pissed on. 98.198.83.12 01:10, September 7, 2009 (UTC)

The simple fact is that no one will never know. Once the nukes begin to fly, not only is a large amount of Earth blown to hell but the records are too. Ever listen to Abraham Washington and what he thinks the history of the US is? It doesn't really matter who or what started it it just matters that it happened and now it's doubtful that humanity will ever fully recover. A sad fate for our species but one that isn't as far fetched as us turning our planet into a masssive greenhouse.--KnightNapier 16:31, December 19, 2009 (UTC)

The ida is completely plausible. Aliens could be, simply, manipulating humanity to observe the actions that occur from it. It's just like a zoo. Nukey ^{(Tok) (Blag)} 03:20, March 24, 2010 (UTC)

I know it's old but the Three unidentified submerged objects detected also match UFO reports that start with UFOs being detected by radar underwater before emerging and flying off. So it could be that the Zetans accidentally started the Great War because they were thought to be Chinese Subs and coupled with the Chinese aircraft detected triggered the U.S to launch their nukes.--Vespidv (talk) 03:46, May 22, 2016 (UTC)

Sources? Climate?

What are the specific sources for some of this?

For example, I see it stated that The Great War changed the climate, but is that actually stated? I don't have all of the canon, so maybe it is...or with the retro-futuristic world we're in, weather control fits with the pre-divergence vision of the future. Now if only the cloud-seeding rockets hadn't been grounded by the war... --Faran Brygo 19:59, April 13, 2010 (UTC)

It's evident. Practically the whole world became an arid desert. _Tagaziel ^(call!) 06:07, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Myron in FO2 explains that it's hard to grow veggies(coca and opium) due to the "new climate." Also in BOS:Tactics ending explains it hasn't rained for decades.--Wert1978 (talk) 00:52, May 28, 2013 (UTC)

Time

I am starting to get confused first people say it takes place in 1950s then the game says it takes place in 2077 WHICH IS IT!!.

The Fallout universe is a retro-futuristic version of what the world would be like if it was as envisioned in the '50s. The Great War happened in 2077. Kris mailbox 08:49, August 21, 2010 (UTC)

Ok that makes more sense Kaeleth 06:30, August 23, 2010 (UTC)

Source on inaccuracy/low yield of nukes?

I realize they had to create a plot device for Fo3 so that DC would actually be explorable, interesting, semi-habitable ruins rather than the world's deepest and widest crater where 25+ multi-megaton nukes all landed in a few square mile area around the same period of time, as DC would undoubtably have been after an IRL nuclear exchange; during the entire IRL Cold War, Russia had at least 3 25-megaton ground penetrating nukes targeted on the Pentagon alone. But that doesn't leave much for the Brotherhood of Steel to set up shop in, does it? Is there any source actually attributing the partial survival of DC to the inaccurate, weak and primitive nukes the Chinese were using? Thanks! 67.246.23.47 05:13, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

What? The Chinese were using nukes that were just as advanced as American ones. They simply had a lower yield (mentioned in Fallout 1's manual). _Tagaziel ^(call!) 08:12, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply! I realize I'm being a fan-wanker, but if the Chinese nukes weren't terribly inaccurate, there's still no explanation for why the FoU DC isn't the world's biggest crater. Maybe in the Fallout universe all nukes are much, much weaker than their IRL counterparts, but even the original 1945 Fat Man would have easily annihilated the entire Pentagon with a direct hit, and it's a huge, easy target for a bomber or missile. DC in Fo3 looks like the Chinese neglected to use any direct-impact nukes. Downtown looks like Berlin circa 1944, not Hiroshima circa 1945. A nuclear fireball is over 1 million degrees; steel, concrete and stone that are touched by the actual fireball don't so much burn as are flashboiled in a nanosecond. It looks like the Chinese just threw a bunch of random, weak airbursts all over the general DC metro area and knocked everything above ground down without too much effort to actually ruin it permanently or burn the survivors out of their bunkers. The true horror of a nuclear apocalypse would have been so much worse, but I guess you can't build a fun, visually-exciting post-apoc game with that kind of restriction. I wonder if Chris Avellone has weighed in on this? 67.246.23.47 09:22, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

Hiroshima isn't representative of the damage an atomic bomb would do to a Fallout city. Note how prevalent concrete, steel and other durable construction materials are in the Fallout universe buildings. Now, consider the fact that most of Hiroshima was constructed from wood, not stone or concrete. The extend of damage and the iconic flattened landscape stem from the fact that the wooden structures burned down or were swept away in the blast, while the few concrete buildings (most notably the Hiroshima Genbaku Dome survived. DC ain't that far from reality as we might think. _Tagaziel ^(call!) 10:28, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

True dat Kaeleth 23:54, August 28, 2010 (UTC)

Saturday?

Saturday? Who starts a war on a Saturday?

Oh. Right then. --Kris 20:55, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Well... Elton John's kind of... a weirdo... Yuri Kaslov

Nickelback did a cover of this song :P --Kris 21:01, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Quotation

Should we put a quotation here by a famous person? I think it would make the article a bit better. Here's two good nuclear war quotes I found:

“If the Third World War is fought with nuclear weapons, the fourth will be fought with bows and arrows.”— Lord Louis Mountbatten.

“I do not know how the Third World War will be fought, but I can tell you what they will use in the Fourth - rocks!”— Albert Einstein.

So what do you guys think? --CHIEF ^{Talk to me} 22:09, October 17, 2010 (UTC)

New Vegas confirms Chinese fired first....

On a console at Black Mountain, the former radar operator added an entry that said something along the lines of "We've detected that the Chinese have fired misslies at us! It looks like they've sent everything they've got! And we're firing right back!"

He then goes to mention that the missiles didn't hit the station, but he was dying from radiation.

reference

the great war happened on october 23rd, that happens to be the same day that the world was created according to that guy who studied the bible to find out how old the world was. reference?

Map?

The map on the page looks like somebody took a map of the world circa 1938 and modified it slightly. Can anybody say if that's the right borders or speculation? Because I highly doubt Germany would somehow regain all of that lost territory (and Austria), even if the UN had dissolved. {{SUBST:Signatures/YuriKaslov}} 02:52, January 9, 2011 (UTC)

hoe do we know?

where is the canon source that tells us that all countries were involved, i mean i dont see any evidence anywhere to say that the USSR was involved and only a small piece of evidence saying it even existed (although im not disputing that it existed) can someone post a link or explain how we know all countries were involved please.

i ask this mainly out of curiosity as im pretty sure that we haven't just made up something kinda major like that.-- 23rd January 2011

Quoting the Fallout 1 intro: In the 21st century, war was still waged over the resources that could be acquired. Only this time, the spoils of war were also its weapons: Petroleum and Uranium. For these resources, China would invade Alaska, the US would annex Canada, and the European Commonwealth would dissolve into quarreling, bickering nation-states, bent on controlling the last remaining resources on Earth. In 2077, the storm of world war had come again. In two brief hours, most of the planet was reduced to cinders.

So basically, everyone who had'em, smoked 'em... nukes I mean.

Another canon reference is Alistair Tenpenny's crossing the whole Atlantic ocean to the radioactive armpit that was the Capital Wasteland because it was apparently "better" than staying in England.Dr. Lobotomy 04:36, January 29, 2011 (UTC)

the things in space guys sattilights

you guys gotta think about the pre war tech in outter space they still have and is probably still working here because its A never touched and B its still operational as u can use one in the DCL for fallout 3 that it would just drop the bomb and since they work simultaneousnessly they drop at same time like the one in megaton so its my theory they used missles and sattilight not planes it would be to hard to do that by plane and sattilights use very little fuel anyone think im right -thekiller of the west so does anyone want to agree with me here its a very valid point any fallout player should know how good it is ok really is anyone going to give an opinion on this i mean its a real brain buster here

Wrong date for the war

This page has the wrong date for the war. It happened in 2077, not 2277. Omne118 18:30, February 8, 2011 (UTC)

Anchorage?

Was just reading through the page and it says that the war only lasted two hours, but China had occupied Anchorage, Alaska by 2066 (according to Fallout 3: Operation Anchorage, atleast) dunno if that was canon or not, but it feels strange they'd just launch all nukes they had 2 hours into a war.

Anchorange is part of the Resource Wars. _Tagaziel ^(call!) 21:42, February 13, 2011 (UTC)

THE SKY

Am I the only one who noticed that the sky in every fallout game is blue, while looking at Earth on Mothership Zeta the atmosphere is GREEN?

twas nukes and perhaps ballistic missles

Its obvious nucleur bombs were launched by many countries. Its the atom bombs found in Megaton and the other one in New Vegas thats confusing everyone. Not to mention the B-29 at the bottom of Lake Mead. Although the B-29 IS AMERICAN, therefore it was obviously taking off to go bomb some other country when it crashed. THIS COULD ALSO BE THE CASE WITH THE ATOMIC BOMBS. They too could have been american bombs, that fell from there carriers when the nukes hit. Not to mention Ballistic missles, that can also be remotely launched, and can travle to any designated target. So in conclusion, atomic bombs may have been on carriers just taking off, as the nukes fell.

You are stupid. The B-29 crashed in 1945. L2Google. _Tagaziel ^(call!) 14:25, February 16, 2011 (UTC)

well i think they dropped nukes from sattilights too

Canada Annexed!

In the Prelude section it says the US annexed Canada in 2076, but in Fallout 3 the Capital Post newspaper with headline "U.S. to Annex Canada!" is dated June 3rd, 2072.

Is 2076 just a typo? Which one would be the actual date? Any thoughts?

"US to Annex Canada" means that the US is planning to annex Canada in the future. 2076 is the date the process is completed. Annexations don't happen overnight, they are a lengthy, complex process involving lots of military, lots of law and lots of drama on both sides. _Tagaziel ^(call!) 08:39, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Your question answered itself. Canada WAS annexed in 2076, while in 2072 the idea to annex Canada was announced.It took 4 years to finnally make the decision

MY TWO CENTS!

Hello Everyone! Wow! I've just read every posting prior to this one by me, for this article. I've learned some tidbits of data that might help some of you if not everyone. Here they are in random order.

1. 00: The Genie Air-to-Air Missile: A tactical nuclear device designed to be launched by one fighter in order to take out one entire enemy bomber squadron with one shot. To be used as a desperate measure or a preemptive depending on the desired outcome of the circumstances.

1. 01: An ICBM launches into sub-orbit and thus brings down death from above on the target. Cruise missiles are terrain "huggers" that fly low to the ground to avoid surface RADAR interception. (By the way, in context, missiles tend to be guided, while rockets are just aimed in the general direction. People used to say "guided missile(s)" before they got tired of doing so, and just said "missile(s)" from then on. Then probably RPG players came long with their gaming term, "missile weapon", and confused people ever since."My slingshot is a missile weapon as is my spear!") The special effects people behind "SUPERMAN: THE MOVIE" further serve to confuse matters by using what appear to be ICBMs as Cruise Missiles.

1. 02: Spitfire and Hurricane pilots both, were sometimes lucky enough to shoot down V-1s and V-2s both. But flying a jet fighter would indeed make it easier to do so.

1. 03: When conventional warfare begins, people on both sides tend to use whatever they have in stock, even if it is obsolete, not just in desperation from not having any other choice, but sometimes to use up the inventory and make room for the hoped for newer machines of war. The USA used piston aircraft in the Vietnam War for instance.

1. 04: You can fight a cold war and a hot war at the same time. Case in point, the Vietnam War, although never officially declared as such, was a hot war during the time of the official "Cold War".

1. 05: The Korean Conflict although not currently hot at the moment, just on "pause", can be resumed at any moment.

1. 06: Japan was almost annexed and made into a state, but at the last moment, they, meaning "Congress", decided to go ahead and allow Japan to remain sovereign after the official surrender ceremony.

1. 07: Midway Island Atoll, is the only part of the whole Hawaiian Islands chain, not to be be made an official part of the State of Hawaii when it became a state. The Kingdom of Hawaii was overthrown by the USA to prevent the UK from owning Pearl Harbor, albeit this was in the 19th Century. (To this day, there are some Native Hawaiians who want to get Hawaiian Sovereignty back, or to at least get the same recognition that other Native Americans get, like the Chickasaw Nation for example of which I'm a member.) So the idea of annexing Canada isn't such a stretch. Besides, there was once a move to try and get Canada to join the Union, with each province becoming a state rather than all of Canada being one huge state. Ditto for Mexico, but by the CSA too.(Oh, by the way, that means then that the Attack on Pearl Harbor and the Battle of Midway, were two attacks on Hawaii, and I bet most people think there was just the one.)

1. 08: "Strategic Air Command" was the USAF program that had bombers on alert and flying close to the USSR. Bombers have longer range than fighters, even among jets, so the Boeing B-52 Stratofortress squadrons flew without escorts more often than with. Such bombers would get the word before missile silos would,since they were already up there. Oh, and let us not forget about boomer submarines like those that carried Polaris missiles.

1. 09: Spies could have used so-called "backpack bombs" that were tactical nuclear weapons.

1. 10: Will David Letterman use this list on his show?

Leo Star Dragon 1.

70.129.174.55 06:19, April 19, 2011 (UTC)

Missile. Noun. 1) An object that is propelled at a target, either by hand or from a mechanical weapon. 2) A weapon that is self-propelled or directed by remote control, carrying a conventional or nuclear explosive. Great Mara 07:11, April 19, 2011 (UTC)

Why October 23rd and not any other date?

Can someone explain this one to me please? --DannyK92 15:13, August 21, 2011 (UTC)

Why not October 23? It's just a random number that they decided to use. There are no observed holidays for any group of ethnicity on that day, so maybe they thought it offend someone if the war to end all wars was on a national holiday. --Kastera ^(talk) 15:24, August 21, 2011 (UTC)

The great war is part of the game or the game plot, should not it also in the category of "setting" or fallout setting? If so, this should be made up. Alessio79 12:37, September 5, 2011 (UTC) It was chipmunks, horny flying ones with icbm backpack s

What a name

Why did they call it the Great War? There's already WWI with that name.

-LucaP1000

Maybe because it was a war that neatly wiped out all life on Earth? I think that qualifies it to be more of a "Great War" than WW1. BMJC17 (talk) 20:42, July 20, 2012 (UTC)

Reason for the war

One thing has always confused me about the Great War in the Fallout universe. How did a worldwide nuclear war develop over fossil fuel resources when there are effective, mass-produced nuclear generators and batteries all over the place, apparently powering the majority of civilian vehicles and the reasonably widely distributed array of energy weapons. You could argue that the disparity between the US/Western Europe who had these technologies and the communist/poorer nations who did not was the source of the problem, but it's clearly stated that the war was sparked mostly by the US and the European Commonwealth moving to secure dwindling oil reserves; the two powers we know for sure had access to advanced nuclear technology.

-Xyyz

Well obviously the transition from fossil fuels to nuclear power has an in-between state. For the nuclear isotopes to be mined requires fossil fuel power, for the nuclear power plants to be built requires fossil fuel power, for the nuclear batteries to be manufactured requires fossil fuel power. In order to establish a substantial nuclear-powered society, many fossil fuel resources must be used in order to make the transition. SigmaDelta54 (Talk) 01:33, April 7, 2012 (UTC)

It's a highly relevant point, but I think that since the Fallout-universe Earth is primarily a caricature of Cold War culture, global politics and technology, it could be presumed that the US was so comically inefficient and voracious by this point it needed both widespread leaky, unsafe consumer nuclear technology AND increasingly vast amounts of fossil fuels to keep up with the demand. As in the system was ultimately unsustainable due to massive overconsumption, blind optimism and patriotism. 67.246.15.91 04:52, June 4, 2012 (UTC)

According to Fallout lore China was on the brink of defeat in 2077. They had been kicked out of Alaska and the US was making good progress (with thanks to power armor) with its invasion of China. They had their backs to the wall and used their last option, a full nuclear strike, knowing a retaliation strike would surly come. This is in accordance with the MAD doctrine.Nick3258 (talk) 14:03, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

Cluster Missiles and Missile failures?

My theory about the whole Missile vs. Planes argument is this. Now, we know that the nukes found in Fallout 3 are atomic-bomb style, meaning they were dropped by planes. Now, what if there were some kind of splitting, projectile missile, a prototype developed by the Pentagon and supplied to the surrounding bases. This could explain how lots of them remain undetonated, as they were not dropped from a high enough altitude to detonate. Below, is a crude ASCII diagram of how these would work.

         ^^^    
         ___ <-- computational nav systems here, for guidance.
       0-III-0
       0-III-0 <--Warheads, mounted to the sides with struts, break off upon command.
       0-III-0
         III<--main body of missile
         III
          I
         ^^^ <---rocket boosters

I believe that the missiles were critical failures, resulting in the warheads breaking off and falling to the mainland, which explains how the Megaton bomb came to be.

Feel free to crush my soul and explain how stupid this is, It's just a theory. :P

---

I'mwiredwithEXPLOSIVES

The Megaton bomb was modeled exactly after the Mark=I "Fat Man" nuclear bomb dropped on Hiroshima. There's zero chance it came from a missile. The boxy thing on the back of the Megaton bomb are the tail steering vanes. Missiles don't have those.

Now, the warheads you have to destroy in Lonesome Road here are most definitely designed to be mounted to intercontinental ballistic missiles, looking something like this from the 1960s era Titan II missile, which was the biggest missile and carried the biggest single warhead in the US arsenal during the Cold War. Note the shape, a cone for the tip of the missile instead of a full bomb.

According to Carol, the ghoul from Underworld, The bombs dropped on the west coast first. The news from the bombs dropping led to a few hours warning before the bombs struck D.C. This could explain the time issue. Not to mention, The Sierra Madre casino is in Mexico. 108.64.16.207 15:53, October 20, 2012 (UTC) ANON

Maybe America nukes itself

I mean how did the americans know to make vaults and test humans. Someone had to know there was going to be a nuclear war. one of the vaults poster said something about a nuclear war happening 1/100000 chance so whats the point of making the vaults if they believed in a nuclear war was 1/100000 and some of the radio towers you activate where shut off mmmm. if you look at the megaton bomb closely you will see a vault like symbol if you get what I mean

srry for my english

Is there any supporting reference material for this entry? :

"The nuclear exchange that characterized the Great War lasted for only a brief two hours, but was unbelievably destructive and reshaped the climate of the world even as it caused the fall of most of human civilization everywhere across the globe. More energy was released in the first moments of the Great War than all of the previous human conflicts in the history of the world combined. Entire mountain ranges were created as the ground buckled and moved under the strain of the cataclysmic pressure produced by numerous, concentrated atomic explosions. Rivers and oceans around the world were contaminated with the resulting radioactive fallout released by the relatively low-yield nuclear weapons used by all sides, and the climate changed horrifically. All the regions of Earth suffered from a single, permanent season once the initial dust blasted into the atmosphere by the nuclear explosions had settled - a scorching, radioactive desert summer."

Hello, i just created a fallout wikia page in vietnamese with my first translated topic was about great war, so anybody who have permission to edit main great war page please add this link to the langue cataloge. Thank you http://vi.fallout.fandom.com/wiki/%C4%90%E1%BA%A1i_Chi%E1%BA%BFn_(Great_War)

New info from Fallout 4 - Defense Intelligence Agency

Seems to be new info on this in Fallout 4 - the Defense Intelligence Agency installation underneath Slocum Joe's --- the one that the Railroad used as base before moving to the church -- has a computer entry that seems to indicate Defcon 1 was initiated due to detection of Chinese aircraft carrying nuclear payloads heading toward the US ... the records of Defcon escalation make it seem like the US launched ICBMs in response to reports of aircraft carrying nuclear payload heading for the US mainland.

Conformation.

Conformation on who started the war!

Is there anymore evidence on this? Because so far it seems like the Enclave president was right all along.

The entries in the DIA terminal are given with date time group (DTG) codes which show that the US was at moderately high readiness (DEFCON3) as of 28 JAN 77. For those who care, DTG format is DDHHMMZMMMYY; DD is the day (01-31), HH is the hour (00-23, 00 is midnight), MM is the minute (00-59), Z is the timezone (the R in the terminal means it is local EST, or +5 Romeo; usually in DTG a Z is used for GMT), MMM is the month (first 3 letters, always all CAPS), YY is the last two digits of the year (00-99). So the entry recorded at 230003ROCT77 was at three minutes after midnight local Boston time on the 23rd of October, 2077; unidentified submersible objects detected near California. Formations of unidentified aircraft were sighted three and a half hours later near the Bering Straights. At 0913 there is a report of possible launches being detected (though it is odd that it is reported by IONDS -- that would detect nuclear blasts, not launches. Unless the OPFOR (opposition forces) ICBMs used nuclear engines, which is possible given a world with nuclear convertibles), and the threat was elevated to DEFCON2 (threat of imminent nuclear attack). NORAD confirmed launch at 0917 and ordered DEFCON1 (the bubble goes up, bend over and kiss your heinie bye-bye). A counter-strike was ordered at 0926. Impacts reported at 0942 in New York and Pennsylvania, system goes offline at 0947. This shows a clear pattern of escalation through the day and the involvement of both an air and ICBM strike, with at least some of the ICBMs possibly being launched from subs. Whatever the initial intent was this seems to be the current timeline, with the US getting attacked before launching its own stuff. It is highly unlikely that the DIA would be spoofed by another agency; they would much more likely be the ones doing the spoofing. It's odd that New York and Pennsylvania would be hit 5 minutes before other east coast locations. Doctrine would be for all attacks to be staged in a way to achieve simultaneous time on target (TOT). Yes, everything has an acronym (YEHAA). However, I wouldn't say that makes the Enclave in any way "right." Maybe they're just less wrong about this one particular thing.

Maybe New York and Pennsylvania were hit by nukes from submarines, as the Yangtze shows the existence of sub based ICBM's Nick3258 (talk) 14:08, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

According to terminal entries located in West Everett Estates, planes (presumably bombers) are seen airborne after the bomb fell on Boston. Also it seems a lot of people survived the great war only to die in the chaos that followed Nick3258 (talk)

According to the Civil Alert System Broadcast that you can listen to after you raise Relay Tower 0BB-915 authorities detected a Nuclear Attack in the morning of Saturday October 23rd. Yarchonis (talk)

Discrepancy

According to to lore, low yield nukes were used in the great war but the captain of the Yangtze said he launched ICBM with high yield warheads?

Also I highly doubt that everywhere in the world was destroyed in the great war. for this to happen almost every country would have to have nuclear weapons (then again with a world turning to nuclear energy over fossil fuels they would have the technology) and when the US and China started their MAD exchange (FYI MAD means Mutually Assured Destruction) all the other countries would have to have been like 'what the hell' lets just destroy the world. Tho the exchange between the US and China would have produced a lot of radiation in itself, and according Lore and Randell Clarke's diary entries in Honest Hearts it rained highly radioactive rain for weeks which killed or mutated everything.Nick3258 (talk) 14:25, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

it's possible that we have simply never seen the effect of high yield nuclear bombing in game before fallout 4. The Glowing Sea was created from just one nuclear warhead, and has become so deadly it is almost an alien landscape. I would expect both the US and China to have a philosophy of quantity over quality, so it's likely that only a small number of submarines possessed nukes of that potency.

as to your idea regarding honest hearts, the pacific coast was hit incredibly hard during the great war, and the radioactive storms likely blew into zion from the west. However, looking at the view of earth present in mothership zeta, the surface of the earth is largely arid, and only the most resilliant species of plants and animals have survived. It's likely that regions that were not nuclear powers or strategic targets survived the great war largely untouched by nuclear fire, but there would have been worldwide radioactive fallout regardless. 99.115.42.193 21:53, November 28, 2015 (UTC)

Fallout 4

FO4 adds more details to this discussion. The Sentinel Site shows that the were trying to mount air dropped bombs onto missile warheads, which indicates that the U.S were converting to a purely ballistic missile arsenal. Also FO4 introduces the presence of SLBM's (Submarine Launch Ballistic Missiles) into the fallout universe. The data from FO4 suggests that the nuclear triad existed in the fallout universe as there are all three components: land based missiles, sea based missiles and bombers.

A terminal entry states the presence of planes being airborne above Boston before she was hit (Waynes log on his terminal in the backyard bunker located at West Everett Estates). This could mean ,like what has been said before, that both the U.S and China had bombers loitering outside each other's airspace's on alert waiting for the order to go. This is also somewhat backed up by the aforementioned log entry, as the Medtech director gets advanced notice of the impending war/doom and Wayne had enough time to get to his kids and get home all on foot before anything happens.

However it still doesn't really give us an indication of what hit Boston first (we can rule out an SLBM as that would of hit in a much shorter amount of time) as an ICBM takes around 30 minutes ,give or take a few minutes, from launch to strike its target, and as Wayne's family had a plan in place they could of made it home in that time. Also as we don't know what type of bombers existed in the fallout universe at the time, whether or not the bombers were subsonic or subersonic or even hypersonic, we can't be certain if the aircraft seen over Boston were American or Chinese or if they hit the city and not an ICBM.

Also I might add that all missile would of had 1 warhead as there is no evidence of the presence of MIRV's in the fallout universe, as the ICBM's in the divide have only one warhead and the failed missile in the Yangtze only had one warhead as well. Nick3258 (talk) 13:20, December 24, 2015 (UTC)

I wouldn't mind seeing a few more cross reference links. For example, the reference to EMP and blackout it may have caused could be linked to Great Blackout

Death Toll

Have we ever received an estimated death toll in any in game source? I base this question on a lack of information in this article, and the fact that the world population was circa 3 billion in the 50's and today stands at 7.2 billion

Fallout Tactics has a special encounter where Death says "7.54 billion people died, just like that (snaps)". Byzant (talk) 19:54, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

Time of the bombs dropping

Shouldnt the part saying that the clocks on the east coast are all stuck at 9:47 be removed? Or atleast not even close to credible. First the most likely case is Bethesda making one texture for clocks and reusing that same texture expecting fans not to focus on clocks. And second even if the bombs fell that wouldnt stop all clocks from ticking, they would tick until the batteries died.

The bombs dropped on Japan stopped clocks at their moments of detonation. While it probably wouldn't stop *all* clocks in DC, it is a thing that happens. Byzant (talk) 19:54, 8 December 2020 (UTC)