Talk:Joshua Graham

From The Vault - Fallout Wiki
Jump to: navigation, search
Archive.png
Archives: #1
Talkpage.png
This talk page is only for discussing improvements to the page "Joshua Graham".
It is not the place for general discussion or sharing stories about the topic of this article. Please use the forums for these purposes.

Dead Money[edit source]

Why does it say he was in DM? Can`t remember anyone metion him there! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Notseanconneryandwillsadlyneverbe (talkcontribs). Please sign your posts with ~~~~!


Can someone get rid of the thing that ses Grahams mentioned in DEAD MONEY? Cuz hes not in DEAD MONEY at all. I can't do it cuz for what ever reason the Wiki won't let me.

Book of Mormon[edit source]

I havent played it yet, but I thought the Book he was reading was a bible, not a book of mormon. The Book of Mormon wouldn't have a cross on it as we do not use the cross as one of our symbols, or is a mistake by the developers? 5t3v0 07:16, May 19, 2011 (UTC)

Oh, or is it just a part of the trailer? Because if so, then I guess it would be safe to say its a bible 5t3v0 07:17, May 19, 2011 (UTC)

It is a Bible, which I thought was odd. While the Bible is indeed an important part of LDS doctrine, it is the Book of Mormon that makes us Mormons and not just Christians. Perhaps they thought it too controversial to place in game, and didn't want to deal with the repercussions. (i.e. "Mormon propaganda in new Fallout add-on...OH NOES!!!") --~Bana 22:03, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
The book does appear in the game as the item named Scripture, the fact that they call it scripture and not the Bible says something. What the book is, is anyone's guess, but there is no definitive canon source on what it is as of yet. The best solution is to refer to it as it in-game name (ie: scripture), as this can cover the Bible as well as other books, and to save any confusion and/or arguments. User:AvatarUser talk:Avatar 01:59, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
Ah, well then that settles it. It was probably just the cross that made it seem like it was a Bible, considering that Mormons have never used the cross as a symbol. --~Bana 22:03, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

The version of the Bible he quotes is the King James. Josh E. Sawyer has stated on his Formspring that Joshua Graham is not strictly labeled as any particular religion. "However you want to label them, they both make it very clear that they believe that Jesus Christ = salvation for the world's people. Really, I think that what they believe is more important than how their beliefs are labeled." Chris Church 05:25, July 6, 2011 (UTC)

This is a mature question. Were Caesar and Joshua Graham lovers?[edit source]

When I asked Joshua about Caesar with the dialogue option, "I'm guessing you don't like Caesar very much." He said, "Love the sinner, hate the sin. With Caesar, it's often very difficult to see through all that sin to the person inside." The way Caesar and Joshua seemed very touchy about the subject and it's rather odd how Caesar has no heirs. 67.169.175.134 02:07, May 22, 2011 (UTC)

Well homosexuality and Mormonism is not a new concept. Despite the way things seem now, same-sex attraction and even same-sex relationships occupy a very significant place in Mormon culture. And the fact that a Mormon missionary would help recreate a society notorious for it's "immoral" ways leaves one to think that he must have had some other motive beyond academic interest alone. ~Bana 22:04, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

I also thought their was some other motive for Joshua to help Caesar, and due to the sings that was the only logical motive I can think of. 67.169.175.134 02:07, May 22, 2011 (UTC)

That could explain Caesar's hate towards homosexuality. Most gay-haters are gays with inferiority complex or smth like that —Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.73.233.227 (talkcontribs). Please sign your posts with ~~~~!
I believe what he meant was loveing your fellow man even if you abhorr the actions they may take.--Gdubs 08:51, May 23, 2011 (UTC)

I have absolutely no problem whether they were lovers or not. I just think it makes sense and makes the Honest Hearts story less hollow and better. 67.169.175.134 15:57, May 24, 2011 (UTC)

Same here. God only knows it needs some gumption in that plot. I was so disappointed in the finished product, I would be happy with anything one could add to such a dry story.~Bana 07:51, May 26, 2011 (UTC)
I liked the Biblilcal references in Honest Hearts, but the add-on seemed so disconnected and irrelevent to the story of the main game and Dead Money, and it seems it has little or nothing to do with Old World Blues and Lonesome Road. Unless there are some tribals, New Canaan survivors, former legionaires, or someone you can give or read the "Scripture" to trapped in the Big Empty or the Divide. I really don't see how the story in Honest Hearts is connected or relevent to the other add-ons. In my opinion Dead Money is better, because the characters and the story were interresting, it's more connected to the main game's story, and actually seems much more connected and relevent to Old World Blues and Lonesome Road. 67.169.175.134 23:56, May 26, 2011 (UTC)

Bandages Removed![edit source]

It says: "If you ask him a "personal" question about his bandages, he says that every day he has to remove the bandages he wore the previous day and put on fresh ones. He mentions the pain he feels when he takes the bandages off, saying it feels the same as when he was set on fire and tossed into the Grand Canyon." And I think: poor guy. --Ranger Breasly 00:07, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

Image[edit source]

There seems to be a bit of a revert war going on with regards to which image we are using on this page with no proper discussion, so I thought I'd centralise things and make it so we can all have a sensible discussion here. The three candidates for image are as follows:

You'll notice I've put them in a gallery format so that we are better-positioned to consider their relative merits. Obviously I am biased - if I could see the advantages of either of the other two images over my preferred one then we wouldn't be having this discussion at all - so feel free to add to the "Why" and "Why not" reasons, and possibly alternative images to the gallery. For posterity I will include the reasons I originally put in the gallery as a permalink [1]. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 20:08, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

The one on the right that Itachou likes. Uniform with most other character articles on the wiki. I also think the left one is the worst of the lot. Great Mara 20:10, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
The infobox image should be in .jpg format, 4x3 dimensions, not include mods and only requires head and shoulders (since the body are pretty much generic models). User:AvatarUser talk:Avatar 20:20, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Well, the one on the left could also be considered to have that "talking head" style, if you consider that the first time you meet Graham he is reloading his guns while you are in dialogue with him. Out of curiosity, is there any set policy on what kind of image we use in characters' infoboxes? Because sometimes we use concept art, sometimes we use full-body renders, sometimes we use what GhostAvatar describes and sometimes we just use a picture of the character doing something cool. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 20:28, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
Bullshit. The image should be in PNG as JPG is a lossy format. http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/0/08/Personal_Sig_Image.gif Tagaziel (call!) 20:25, May 21, 2011 (UTC)
.png's losslessness is only really an advantage for small images like icons, or if you want to use a transparent image. The file size in .jpg images is far better in terms of compression and the amount of loss can be mitigated by a good image editor. Also, can we discuss how much of the character the image should show? Tazagiel originally removed the image on the left in favour of a lower quality image because it showed more of the character, but this contradicts GhostAvatar's statement that it should be head and shoulders only, as well as Tazagiel's later image preference. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 20:32, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

┌─────────────┘
It terms of lossy versus loseless, .jpg files on low compression rate has no discernible difference in quality to the naked eye. However they do have a marked difference in size, resulting in more bandwidth being used by the viewer (ie: download-time). That is why it is the preferred image format, but not the de-facto image format in these cases. User:AvatarUser talk:Avatar 20:37, May 21, 2011 (UTC)

Isn't PNG generally favorable to JPG because it is of higher quality? Yuri(Leave a message!) 02:09, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
The quality difference is negligible with a large, well-compressed .jpg file. That's why .jpg files are used for photos. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 02:11, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
Overall, all Wiki favors PNG and all sites in general. PNG is the best format that keeps the maximun usable information on the images, unlike any other format like gif, jpeg etc. but this is not an obligation.
For the image of the character in general, the talking head style would be the best because it corresponds perfectly to the Fallout style (and that's usually the format used for other characters), the rest (4:3, 16:9 etc.) is for me completely optional. The use of mod should be banned, they are unofficial and they distorts the original style and quality desired by the developers. Itachou [~talk~] 14:09, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
And why, exactly, is that listed as part of the "why nots"? If it is so negligible, it shouldn't be mentioned at all. After all, wikis have an infinite amount of space which can be used to add any sort of content, so .PNG's larger file size doesn't matter in the long run. Yuri(Leave a message!) 14:34, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
The space on the wiki isn't the issue here, it's the loading times of pages. We need to be thinking about readers who don't have high-speed browsers, or use mobile internet. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 14:45, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
Then obviously, we should strip everything out and present the Vault as pure text only. Wikia is already bloated and loading pages takes a lot of time. The extra 40kb isn't going to make a difference when you have in excess of 400 kB to load. http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/0/08/Personal_Sig_Image.gif Tagaziel (call!) 21:34, May 23, 2011 (UTC)

I'm Jealous[edit source]

Of the fact that only the PC players will be able to make a mod to wear Graham's bandages. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.227.15.99 (talkcontribs). Please sign your posts with ~~~~!

Soft-C Caesar[edit source]

I think it should be noted in the Notes section that Graham pronounces Caesar's name with a soft C, unlike almost every other Legion-affliated character in the game. It's not clear to me whether this is a production oversight or some kind of intentional slight to Caesar on Graham's part, but either way it seems notable since he was the guy's right-hand man AND a language specialist. BeatrixRussell 00:46, May 23, 2011 (UTC)

Exactley he's a language specialist so he pronounces it the way americans pronounce it with a soft-c its mostly the assimilated tribals that say it with a hard-c. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Gdubs (talkcontribs). Please sign your posts with ~~~~!
Yeah, I imagine the tribals pronounce it with the dipthong because they were raised saying it that way. Graham doesn't pronounce it the way Caesar wants because that would be playing up to Caesar's power fantasy. --Lugiatm (talk · contribs) 11:57, May 23, 2011 (UTC)
Its because Graham knows that Caesar is copying the Roman Emperor. Similar to Arcade Gannon knows it too. He realizes the history behind it, unlike the uneducated legion soldiers --Smish34 (talk) 00:49, July 26, 2011 (UTC)

-

It's a Miracle![edit source]

During the last quest where Joshua Graham is your compagnion, I noticed he never smims... Instead he just walked over the waters surface... I tried it out after i noticed this a few times and he kept doing this, or run around trough shallow parts/land to avoid the water.

It was a bit like teleporting though and I am pretty sure it is some sort of bug/glitch but can anyone else check this? He just seems to avoid swimming...--BlitzKrieg-BoB 21:32, May 23, 2011 (UTC)

No, I think he can just walk on water. I'm saying it was intentional. ~Nathan

Never seen other NPCs glitching and running across water? It's simply a bug not even unique to Joshua Graham. --24.67.153.218 02:54, October 9, 2011 (UTC)

100 Repair?[edit source]

The article says he can repair up to 100, is this based on anything the player does? I noticed on one play through he could not repair my stuff to full, then after a few quests and level ups I came back and he could repair them to I think 75. --Bottrot 03:32, June 4, 2011 (UTC)

I am the right hand of the Lord, and the instrument of his vengeance.

It depends what level you are. I got him to repair 100% at level 16.

Joshua Graham's superhuman strength[edit source]

I don't care how tough you are, getting set on fire and thrown into the Grand Canyon can't do your body any favours yet still, the Malpais Legate is stronger than most characters, possessing a DT of 50, much higher than any player character. I think there should be some mention of these inhuman qualities. He may claim it's to do with his faith or his rage but I believe that if a guy with full body burns and numerous broken bones can crawl through the deadliest place in post apocalyptic America, he must have some genetic quality making him more impervious to injury. Perhaps this links into his unusual immunity to chems. It's a perplexing thing, maybe only worthy of the trivia section but certainly worthy of note.

Or... maybe he picked really good SPECIAL stats and perks. I know what you're saying, but my Courier gets set on fire, shot and stabbed every day, and survives with a DT of about 20. Even in your post you mixed game stats with story info, and of course the designers did the same. There's no reason why there couldn't be someone else as tough or tougher than the Courier in the wastes (let's hope more than one, or Lonesome Road will be a letdown), and it turns out there is. Try shooting him and see what happens :-). He has a DT of 50 because he's Joshua Graham. --FourWayDiablo 02:14, June 30, 2011 (UTC)

Killing him?[edit source]

Is there any way for the player to kill Graham, while still being able to complete the majority (if not all) of the quests Honest Hearts has to offer? 82.156.214.20 03:00, July 9, 2011 (UTC)

Hmmm. I would assume the answer is no but I never tried that... because it seems unnecessary. In Fallout I usually need a reason to kill someone. That usually means this person is my enemy, a Quest target or they have a unique or rare item that I want. With Graham. He isn't a target or an enemy and you get all unique items at the end of Honest Hearts. It just seems unnecessary.

R2Tally 17:07, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Like that guy's hat. Plan to kill him in his sleep! 8D User:Great_MaraUser talk:Great_Mara 17:24, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

If you want to do most quest's and still kill him just do all the quests until you have to choose to side with daniel or joshua then kill joshua because you can't kill him after that quest--Chargersphinx 15:47, October 2, 2011 (UTC)

Weird bug[edit source]

Nothing major. Just a rather creepy graphical glitch. At one point in the Crush the White Legs quest, Joshua's hands randomly enlarged into huge somewhat skeletal hands with fingers extending past the barrel of his .45.--Darth Oblivion 05:04, August 1, 2011 (UTC)

Making him Non-Hostile[edit source]

During the final part of the dlc, I accidentally shot a Dead Horse soldier thinking he was a White Leg. I saved right after I did it. I have an earlier save that is quite a bit before the final mission. I'd rather not restore to that save if there is any other way around it.

Joshua is now hostile to me when I spawn for the final part of the mission where you fight Salts-Upon-Wounds. Holstering my weapon doesn't stop him, I have to kill him or he'll kill me. This is not what I want to do.

Is there a console command that I can use to reset my faction with the New Canaanites or just Joshua Graham or whoever I'd need to reset it with to get him to stand down? I'm pretty frustrated that one stray bullet has him completely against me.

I don't think you can kill him while he's following you he just goes unconcious so i suggest reloading your save where he's hostile and shoot him until he's unconcious then finish the quest he will awaken after a bit but he might be non hostile when he gets up but since you saved just test your options--Chargersphinx 15:45, October 2, 2011 (UTC)

Caesar is dead...[edit source]

Thought this might be of interest to players who reach Joshua while Caesar is still alive, and may not have seen the dialogue. Too big for the Notes section, which is already massive.

The Courier's speech options, and Joshua's replies:

  • Courier: "Caesar is dead. I saw to it personally. I thought you should know."
  • Graham: "I have to admit, it's hard to believe. That even after all he did to me, all he tried to do to find and erase me from this world, he went first. No doubt this will be good for the Mojave. I can only hope Arizona and the tribes don't suffer as the Legion falls apart around them."
Option 1:
  • Courier: "They won't. I'll make sure the Legion has very little to go home with."
  • Graham: "Hmm, good. You're doing God's work, whether you believe it or not."
Option 2:
  • Courier: "We'll see."
  • Graham: "The Lord shall reveal all things in good time."
Option 3:
  • Courier: "You don't think Lanius can lead the Legion?"
  • Graham: "I think only Caesar can lead the Legion. I've never met anyone who could take his place. I couldn't. I never had a mind for logistics. I don't know Lanius, but from what I've heard, he has no interest in leading anyone unless it's in battle. No. The Legion dies with Caesar. What follows now are just the last steps of a man who does not yet realize that he's walking dead."

--FourWayDiablo 13:42, August 22, 2011 (UTC)

Yes, characters with good intelligence as Marcus and Joshua can easily see that the Legion will collapse with the death of Caesar (Lanius is just a bloodthirsty beast, he will be unable to take the reins). Anyway I don't agree with Joshua, I think he could have held the reins of the Legion and half of the Caesar's Legion ideas come from him, since he is the co-founder. Itachou [~talk~] 14:07, August 22, 2011 (UTC)

you can pickpocket joshua[edit source]

you can actually pickpocket joshua graham as long as he's asleep and you have the mister sandman perk(works with daniel too). "a light in shining darkness" will not show even if you take his bullets and put a replacement weapon(i put a mantis glove).

True! Also, you DO NOT need the Mister Sandman perk, I just tried it without the perk and was still able to pickpocket him! Somebody should change the article to let everyone know it is still possible to pickpocket, yet you can't get his unique .45 auto pistol.Felix Brehh 05:42, September 4, 2011 (UTC)

While the pickpocketing may be news, it says on the host page that he uses a non-playable version of A Light Shining in Darkness. - David Hellsly

Beyond that (since you get the pistol regardless by either completing the DLC or killing Graham), all the caps you spend on repairs can be pickpocketed from him. You have to immediately fast travel before he can reclaim them or he turns hostile (as you will probably be caught if you spent any significant amount on repairs) or else you fail all unfinished quests. So, essentially, he performs 100% repairs for nothing. --DeadlyPrey(talk) 02:57, October 10, 2011 (UTC)

I noticed something strange when wearing Joshua Graham's armour. When speaking to certain NPCs such as Ranger Milo near Nelson and Emily Ortal outside the Lucky 38, I had access to unique dialogue options to do with Joshua Graham. Stuff like "The names Joshua Graham" and a barter speech check of "Dr. Joshua Graham diagnoses a lack of discussion of caps here" or something. I don't know if this is to do with the fact I'm wearing his armour or if its to do that my character is called "Joshua Graham". Has anybody else noticed this?

Nah dude, that's normal, some of the NPCs ask for your name, it was just coincidence that you named your character that. --Felix BrehhUser talk:Felix Brehh 00:48, September 30, 2011 (UTC)

pistol holstering[edit source]

Xbox 360Icon xbox360.png Don't think I've ever seen Graham holster his pistol with the barrel pointing down. Is this something that should be listed under bugs or does it have to do with his unique melee attack? --DeadlyPrey(talk) 03:03, October 10, 2011 (UTC)

Guess I answered my own question. I've always pickpocketed his ammo and never noticed the position of his gun otherwise. --DeadlyPrey(talk) 04:05, October 10, 2011 (UTC)

Age?[edit source]

If he went with Edward Sallow to Arizona in 2246 he has to at least be in his early sixties... Should that be noted?

--BLACKHAWK1989 13:10, November 18, 2011 (UTC)

Joshua Graham Glitch?[edit source]

I can't seem to talk to Joshua Graham at all. This occurred on the PS3, I went to there camp by myself. Oh there's also this green haze, or lighting that occurred several times throughout the day.

Can anyone look into this?

Porter Rockwell[edit source]

I would just like to bring the wikis attention to what I think is cultural reference in this characters unique class "Destroying Angel". This might just be a reference to Porter Rockwell, who was known as "the Destroying Angel of Mormondom". Like Joshua, who is extremely resilient, he was prophesied to be indestructible by Joseph Smith. I am not well versed in this particular piece of folklore, but I think the similarities, even at this superficial level are sufficient to warrant a Trivia reference. I am posting this because I haven't this mentioned in neither the cultural references page nor this talk page.

I believe Josh Sawyer, the guy that wrote and designed Graham, made this reference and touched upon it in a formspring answer he did. 06:07, 26 December 2012 (UTC)